everyone is focused on the 5yr as guaranteed life time. The small prints reads “we target a 5yr life time”. Since the phone lacks NFC I will have to upgrade it soon: many shops already offer mobile payment. That will set me back another 50€ at least (the previous spare parts were not cheap!).
Whether or not against the FP philosophy: I like to decide myself if and when I buy a new phone. You can also argue that with buying as many as often as you like you provide more support to improve labor conditions.
Going for a more expensive phone that is more expensive: the phone is good value for money given the social value component, but the 525€ is just beyond my comfort zone of an impulse buy.
I really like the next Fairphone and all the measures taken to make it more durable. I’m not going to buy it myself, because I’m hoping to use my current Fairphone for a few more years. Maybe I can even use this one for 5 years - this is my first smart phone and before that I used my basic Samsung for over 7 years. I’m amazed at the amount of people saying they’ll still want a new phone every 2-3 years. If that is the case, more attention should be paid to the recycling process and maybe being able to upgrade a phone to include better features, because there are already way too many phones being thrown away as it is. One of the core ideas behind Fairphone is wanting to reduce that waste.
I’m also wondering about the price remarks - would you find it more acceptable if the phone were to be included in a plan so you can pay for it in instalments? I know there have been a few telecom companies that offered the first edition in that manner.
Yes, I think it would be good to have a low-end phone that can be upgraded over time. That is, I would like to pay less now and choose what and how to upgrade, paying for single modules afterwards.
It seems to me that you say it costs more because it is modular. I don’t think so, I think it costs more because it already includes hardware that is going (hopefully) to be “not-so-old” in five years.
I’m still happy with my 5-year-old non-fair smartphone, I paid it a little more than 300 euros and it only needs a new GPS (it has a defective module) and some additional RAM, since apps are becoming more demanding. I would have liked to have it repairable and upgradable. So, I’m still satisfied with the most part of the hardware and it costed only 300 euros 5 years ago!
With the current specs of Fairphone 2 (Snapdragon 801, 2GB RAM, 5 inch 1080p display, LTE, etc.) it compares to last years top devices (Samsung Galaxy S5, HTC Once M8, Sony Xperia Z3, LG G3, etc.).
Hmm, that is a creative argument, but i do not think i can follow it. Fairphone is a social enterprise and part of that means they should thrive to operate sustainable and minimize their ecological impact. Of course you are free to buy phones as often as you like, but i do think it is the most sustainable thing to do. And i do not think that this is an argument against the price.
This is possibly a good think. 525€ is neither an impulse buy for me. I think if we realize the process involved in producing and recycling electronics like smartphones, we should not buy them like sweets or fruits, but try to think about our needs and reflect if we really need a new phone "just because of … NFC, Android 5.0, 12MP camera, fill in what you like here.
That sounds a bit off. Nobody forces you to upgrade just because some shops offer you NFC payment. I doubt NFC will ever be mandatory for payments. If ever replaces credit cards, i think that will be well over a decade from now.
I’m not sure how upgradable this phone will be, as developing the required future-proof interfaces is a expertise in itself. Observing the reactions, the modularity might motivate a lower-spec core module or screen as to reduce the overall price. I too believe it to be costly, considering that my main motivation for discarding other phones were battery and operating system, both of which would be covered in the Ubuntu phones of Bq for under 200 euro. So for me that is 325 euro’s for having a fair purchase and the ensurance of serviceability.
This concept also allows us to create multiple variations of the cover and in time, we intend to offer covers with different levels of protection and/or additional functionality.
[quote=“Emma, post:42, topic:6579”]
I’m also wondering about the price remarks - would you find it more acceptable if the phone were to be included in a plan so you can pay for it in instalments? I know there have been a few telecom companies that offered the first edition in that manner.[/quote]
To reply to your question, I won’t buy a phone through a subscription plan anytime soon; but that’s because I live in France where subscriptions for SIM cards only are quite cheap
@nicorikken Yes, that should be the very least I’m not entirely sure I understand the procedure to install what you describe as a replacement core module. We would have to completely open up the phone to install this module ? It doesn’t sound very easy or safe for the phone. But I concur with the idea to have it for review and to either keep it or try another module.
Concerning Ubuntu Touch, I’m not up-to-date on this ability. So if the community ports Ubuntu Touch on the FP2, Ubuntu will supply updates without any interference ? The only thing missing is that the system wouldn’t be well optimized on this phone.
In Austria ATM-cards have NFC now and I see them as far more competitive as a wireless paying method than smartphones. I think those two commodities shouldn’t be merged because then, if you’d loose your smartphone, you end up without money as well.
@Vinth Indeed that would require opening the phone, removing most modules, swapping the core, and screwing everything back in place. Indeed that is cumbersome, but faster to reverse than reinstalling and restoring back-ups. I don’t know if it is feasible, it was just an idea.
Lucakly Ubuntu has been updating their documentatation recently. Porting a device comes down to getting the device support working within the framework of Ubuntu touch, partly by incorporating the device-specific drivers. Having done the minimal device-specific stuff which is very static, the device can now benefit from the continual development from Ubuntu touch via so-called Image Channels. Ubuntu seems to be wanting to take the responsibility for building the updates, although anyone could build their own image and distribute as it is all free (libre) software.
All is said for me… I wouldn’t have “triggered” for my present FP if its cost had been so high.
The huge increase lauched me in a long meditation, all the more that in parallel I bought a Jolla tablet (independent OS neigher Google nor Apple, but not specially fair) for €200.
Visibly I can invest €200 in something I believe is important, but not 500.
I’ll use my FP1 till its end…
As current FP1 owner (and looking to replace that 'round year-end) I’ve looked at the specs with quite some interest. So, here’s my first impression.
Integrated case is a nice idea. Extra bulk is not an issue, since basically all “slim” phones get wrapped in a bulk-adding protective case anyway.
Modularity / easy repairability is equally nice. Will have to see how far FP can take this idea of course, but it sure looks promising.
5y life expectancy is probably a bit optimistic, even considering the quite decent 801 SoC. The smartphone world just moves too quickly to make any reasonable prediction over a 5y period. 3y sounds more realistic. 3y is still quite nice though (average smartphone life is 'bout 18 months I believe, so 3y would still double that).
5" screen is a little too large for my taste, esp. considering the “fat” bezel. 4.5 - 4.7 would be the sweet spot for me (fits into trousers pocket easily, 5" much less so). But the screen on its own is not a deal braker, and let’s face it, you need the 5" screen if you want to target 3y of use.
Price is a bit high. So was the FP1’s btw, but it feels like the FP2’s “fairness premium” is a bit more than it was on the FP1. 450 would have been a no-brainer for me. 525 much less so (it’s the wrong side of the 500,- line).
Sure hope GPS performance (including when powered via USB!) is much improved over FP1. Would be a deal-breaker right there if it weren’t.
Likewise for the open source / alternative OS talk. Esp. after the FP1 fiasco.
So overall: pretty nice phone. Count me interested. But because of the final 3 points (price, GPS, software), I’m holding off for now.
@Vinth
sorry, if you got this statement wrong…
but a few posts earlier someone (or was it you) mentioned, that the new owner should install the OS he likes. that way the owner could learn how the OS works and where to find what…
looking at my friends (everyone in the late 40s or early 50s) I definetely can say this: that would be a total desaster. BUT if all one has to do is: push 1 for android, 2 for sailfish, 3 for firefox and then an automatic installation would be starting - I am with you… then the phone should be empty…
@Ro_Land_Pickl@Vinth That’s how I interpreted it, combined with information about the pro’s and con’s. Just as Fairphone has been exposing the story about mining and manufacturing, it could expose the story about software practices.
The phone looks fantastic, no doubt about that. The modular/easily repairable design is awesome. And I’m keen to see what further work on fairer minerals has gone into this - because the phone design isn’t everything
On price, yeah it’s higher than the first, however there has been a lot more design effort gone into this and FP don’t have masses of money to pour into development like HTC/Samsung/Apple. Hopefully people that find the cost prohibitive will be able to get one on contract through network providers etc and maybe this will make it more palatable. The iPhone costs a lot if you buy it out right, which most people don’t.
Maybe I formulated my arguments not as crisp as needed.
First, I’m obviously not going to buy as many phones as possible to support the cause. It’s way more efficient to buy one phone and donate than buy two phones to support the cause
Impulse buy: I’m kind-of a gadget freak. Some people buy shoes, other tools, I gadgets. (probably from my time at Nokia). So I just like to have one, even if strictly speaking not needed (I still have a working N95). But if 525€ is beyond the comfort zone of a collector, it’s not cheap. And let’s be fair, there’s little logic behind collecting things, be it stamps, shoes or gadgets.
NFC: The current price is 525€ excl NFC. The concept is that the device is scalable, so it is possible to add that later. Conclusion: the price is 525€ + cost for NFC. The fact that shops don’t require payment by NFC, doesn’t mean people don’t want payment by NFC mobile phone. Any given payment method is also highly localized. In Finland parking your car with coins is considered old-fashioned, and sometimes not possible. You pay your coffee of 1.80€ by credit card.
For me the argument that 525€ is not expensive because “you don’t need NFC (wireless charging,…)” doesn’t cut it. The cost for these functionalities comes on top of the current phone, and have to be included in the price
However, the modular design can also be used differently. Don’t upgrade in the future, but downgrade the current model to make it affordable. I could do with a lower-end processor, and for me the Gorilla glass is nice but Dragontrail will do. (See also my arguments on downgrading below)
I’m not entirely sure I understand the procedure to install what you describe as a replacement core module. We would have to completely open up the phone to install this module ? It doesn’t sound very easy or safe for the phone. But I concur with the idea to have it for review and to either keep it or try another module.
