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Will fairness be accessible for me?

Yep, did it that way, thanks! I just skipped through the three files. But it’s more for awareness/education … not a soft version of a “BoM” or something at least widely related, so one could compare the fair parts inside the FP1 with the ones in the FP2.

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In case you are looking for valid reasons to justify spending 500 € for a FP2 towards your community, your spiritual authority and yourself: This kind of device is called a ‘phone’ for historical reasons, but it is much more than that. It is an ultra-compact, portable, mobile-network and WiFi enabled computer. Not quite a general purpose computer in the sense a PC is, but a computer, still. For a good (special purpose) computer, and a fairer-than-average produced one at that, 500 € does not seem to much to me.

Thus I think that if your community and you agree that it needs this kind of computer for your social work, additionally to the computer(s) you already have, and the community can afford it, I don’t see why they should not spend that money. Note that it wrote ‘it [i.e., the community] needs’, not ‘you need’. While it would be bewildering for most of us to consider our smart phone anything but a personal gadget, I think the way of life you chose might allow to view this device as a tool. A tool belonging to the community and shared between those Friars that require it for what they do, not a personal property. Just like you probably do with other valuable or expensive tools that the community keeps not to amass richness or have its members live in luxury, but as means to a (good) end.

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I’d say, the ‘advanced technology’ also specifically allows for much easier repairability than with the FP1 with this ‘Lego blocks’ design, and this is very significant.
But so, so costly is the difference…

The modularity and hopefully (we will know more soon) more open software are very good steps forward. But not a lot has changed regarding the “fairness” inside the actually sold phone. That’s not wrong, but one should be honest about that.

It’s okay to just sell a “better” phone to add new people to the project and raise awareness. But it’s also important to let the people know the full amount of reached and improved fairness in- and outside the phone and what was accomplished in the background (“electronics supply chain”), so people do not feel tricked in the end.

I like how @keesj defined the project goals in the replicant discussion: “… producing a phone to improve the electronics value chain one step at a time.”

I guess this time, a lot more fairness went into campaigning, the design, and talking to the suppliers from the miners up to the manufactures, than into the phones’ real materials. At least this is how I understand the blog entries. And that’s fine with me.

So the improved values this time are: A more expensive SoC (I assume) with a more modular own/OEM based more stable phone design, press coverage that lead to more awareness for the goals, the audit/improvement of two OEMs, and maybe, the partly more open software, we soon will know more about.

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I do not think you need to sacrifice your desire to connect with the world to teach younger people something.

I also would advice for a second hand FP1 or to wait a short while (what’s another 18 months or so after all) aqnd then buy a FP2 second hand.

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Frère Pottier,
in case nothing else works, getting a Jolla tablet (at around €200) may be an alternate solution.

Hardware wouldn’t be fair, but on the contrary, software is extremely fair, in the sense it’s practically the last* operating system independent from the american giants Google and Apple.

You would exchange hardware fairness against software one IMHO, although it’d be worth checking the relative importance of each one.

All the best,
Hervé
(*) there also is the Blackberry OS

Wel ! It will be possible for me to be fair. Because there is a real community around the Fairphone.
All your replies show your interest to this question. Many thanks to you.

But most of all, I’m just receiving a Post package. I’ve still not open it. I guess it contains a Fairphone 1 sent by one of you for free.
I think maybe he would remain anonymous. Magari lui vuole rimanere anonime :wink: It is to him to reveal himself as he want. But it is to me to thank him, anonymously and publicly.
Thousand thanks to him.
Thanks for the fairphone !
And thanks for the noble gesture !

Now, I have 300€ that would go to the refugees organization in Besançon.

Even if the cost of the new Fairphone is too high to make fairness at hand to every one, I can testimony that the community takes over from the company.
And I encourage the community to strength this way to spare fairness.

Thanks to Fairphone to make it possible with the site, the forum and the private messages.
A suggestion : Would it be possible to develop a “second-fifth hand exchange place” on the site ? It would be a other way for Fairphone to support the community and the longevity of its material. Maybe at forum.fairphone.com/c/second-hand.

Once more : Thanks to you all ! God bless you (if it makes sens for you).
I leave you : I have a package to open…

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Thats an awesome story! @Daria_Fairphone and @joe take note! :slight_smile:

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Wow, that is really great.

We have this:

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I hate to be the grumbling grumbler, but one could also call that area the “ebay announcement” thread.

It would be nice to see some more “fair” offers there. I’m not trying to put pressure on the people doing this (that’s totally fine) but if you just sell your phone on ebay to get the next new one, that does not make a lot of sense to me.

In that case it would be better to buy a used phone (It’s resources have already been wasted and it looks like you need the money.). Else the new “fair” phone is just a show-off tool and you fell for the marketing. But if you can easily afford two “fair” phones … give one away for free.

No, I’m not trying to stop people from buying the FP2. And I’m sure they will reach the level and it will be build (it will be build anyway). But just buying the next new item because it’s new was something the fair phone project tried to avoid, a least in the beginning.

If would be nice to give money to the FP project without having to buy a phone. Maybe just sell the phone here and give the FP project a cut? Or give them back some of the difference to the FP2 if you buy an older used phone?

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Hey guess what, I agree with you :smile:

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Yeah, i think it would be better if that area was more of a community thing and not just links to ebay auctions. This is why i personally contacted people interested to buy. On the other hand, ebay provides a lot of security for both seller and buyer, so in kind of understand…

Anyway, i think it is way better to sell ysour old phone directly instead of putting it in a drawer until it is worth nothing but for recycling. This way, that precious piece of electronics is returning to the market. And i gues most people looking for a second hand Fairphone would buy a smartphone anyways. And if they cannot find a used Fairphone, they possibly go for a new cheap model. Nobody is helped with that either :smile:. It is simply possible that the Fairphone does not fullfil everybodys needs or people simple can’t seem to get around Android. Why should they not offer their phones to interested people?

I for example start to work an a company developing an innovative product relying on Bluetooth 4.0 beacons connecting to smartphones. It’s a small start-up and I want do be able to test and use that product myself. I will need another Smartphone for that and i think about switching to the FP2.

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Good luck with your new job! I hope you will learn a lot of new useful things. I hope to see the blob list soon. If it is short it will be a great developer phone. Ask your company to also get a Nexus :smile:, most things can be emulated.

Honestly the FP1 is not very good hardware, selling it on ebay for lifestye is a bit of a rip-off. It’s currently stuck with 4.2-4.4 and has some hardware and more software issues. If the owner keeps it to see what the FP project will come up with, good. Giving it away, telling the people they are stuck with 4.x right now, also fine … “collecting it” … not so useful, I agree.

I’m just concerned that people sell their old phone and buy a cheaper new non-FP one, because current one is pretty expensive. This will not help the project or its goals. The FP2 is not for the masses … it just one or two steps behind the latest and greatest (810-820). But one could easily buy a brand new SD80x based phone for 200EURs.

I would prefer that those people would buy a used phone and be also able to still contribute to the FP project (by some money or by testing the software – SD8xx based phones are pretty much the same, except for the blobs).

Thank you! :slight_smile: I already did :thumbsup:. We have a Nexus, already. That’s fine for development, by I want to use the product myself.

A good SD801 based phone like the Z3 is around 400€ or 380 for the S5, not 200€. They probably have a better camera and NFC though, so you have a point. But i think you exaggerated a bit. :wink:

The Snapdragon 820 is annouced, but not yet sold in devices as far as i know. And the Snapdragon 810 has a not so good standing in tests and blogs due to heat issues. The 801 is still a very good, capable, SoC.

It is getting a bit of topic. But you are right, if the FP1 is sold and a Samsung bought instead, the project is not helped. I still think buying a used FP1 is a good way to support the FP1 project since you support early adopters. If you bought a FP1 and now find out it does not fulfil your needs, you would be desperate if it also lost is value as fast as some other Android devices. Therefor I am happy this is not the case with the FP1. People who sold their FP1 might still adhere to the goals of the project and come back later.

If the FP2 is for the masses or not is another topic. I think it is for everybody who agrees with Fairphones goals. If this is really true is something we will see if the FP2 has been in the use for some months. I have high hopes.

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Same here. I won’t say any brands here, because they buy from a pretty bad supply chain. I could never find out if the FP project also buys from those suppliers because I never saw a list of electronic items used on the FP2. sad smiley

I’m sure that people that had a FP1 will not look at cheap china phones first, but they will end up rebranded here as well.

I would like to think of the FP2 as the “Nexus” of phones that helps “fixing” second hand phones from “braver” (=improved, certified supply chain) companies with newer software. Users could give something to the project by giving something back for the rom that will make their phone last longer (similar to what was CM in the beginning). This would help the 2nd hand market a lot.

But I fear this will never come true. Marketing and business does not work like this. And even if the FP project would hire programmers for this, they will never get the blobs/info needed. But maybe it could work. I don’t know.

I agree with the FP goals. But right now it is not for me, they still have not published where they get their electronics from, the blob list or the FP1 code. I will just wait a little while longer. I know they don’t do this to mislead us, they are just waaaaay to busy. I don’t need to be the first one buying a FP2. If it works, it will be around for a long time, I hope. :wink:

------- Last update, after the topic was closed ------
The topic is closed now, too bad I thought it was an interesting discussion that fitted @FrViPofm initial underlying rhetorical question “is it possible to be fair, sustainable, free and poor ?” Maybe we can one day (when the FP2 is released and everybody is not so tense anymore) open a new topic and discuss it again with the Fairphone project people?

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This is really getting off-topic (and besides it is not getting anywhere :slight_smile: ).

The case was solved with @FrViPofm’s last post.

Epilogue :

Here is a picture of my/your/our fairphone starting its life in Besançon.

Laudato si’

Thanks to all of you.

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Beautiful story, @FrViPofm. Thanks for sharing!

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