Shareholders discount

Hello.
I’m disappointed about the treatment of shareholders. I supported FP since the beginning, buying FP1 and FP2. I was advocate before referring program begin.
I’m shareholder too, since the crowdfunding. And nothing is done for those who supported FP when they really needed it, even a 10€ voucher.
For a company that talk about being part of a movement, about community, I think it’s ungrateful. Even someone that reads the newsletter (I’m not fluent enough in english) is better treated.
Don’t you think it would be normal ?

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Hi mytro
first and foremost: welcome to the forum!

Maybe we both got different points of view but I don´t have much expectations about projects I support. At least not in a ‘more or less’ financial way.
If I´d expect some financial return then I wouldn´t call it being a supporter but an investor.
That´s a difference from my point of view.

Furthermore as you mention it: shareholder.
I´m not sure how the FP share developed over time. If it developed positive then there´s already a payback. If not then that´s the risk every shareholder got.
But besides this aspect in general I ask myself: Don´t you get dividends for the shares you got?
Could be another payback that adds up to it (or at least compensates the share loss).

But I´m also curious about your personal expectation. What would you like to get in return?

Last but not least I don´t think that ‘movements’ never had a focus on raising only the members situations in any way. What I understand as a ‘movement’ is something that drives the whole society and all those benefits are indirect. Something like ‘enabling the possibility for a better future’ instead of ‘pampering’ their own supporters and members.

Best
Don Fnord

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I fully agree with @DonFnord : what you get is imho that by being part of the movement you’ve given it more momentum.
Read the impact report to learn more about the effects.

These shares are a long-term investment. They are not freely tradeable, so there is no market valuation for them at the moment. They remain with the crowdfunders (unless transferred with permission of the administrators) until the next investment round, where it is up to investors to determine how much Fairphone is worth.

You should check the financial reports to know how your investment is doing, you get them every half year if you are a shareholder. They can’t be disclosed publicly, but from page 32 of the 2021 impact report, as well as the sales statistics, you can get an idea how FP has grown since the crowdfunding in 2018.

At the moment, Fairphone invests profits back into the company instead of paying out dividends (as shareholder, you should be able to find more details in the financial report that you receive every half year.)

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Thanks a lot for that information! :slight_smile:

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I wasn’t expecting for something very valuable, I know that my investment isn’t payfull (I don’t ask for any dividend). But I think that an attention to show to support that they’re important would be the minimum (for example: the same discounts than codes in newsletter).
I would have been happy if they told me : “there is the newsletter code”. It would show some interest.
I’m not only shareholder, I was a buyer since FP1. Being responsible is also buying my phone when I need it, not when a new one is online, or for special opportunities (why ? Is it reasonable ?)
In my country, new customers are better treated than loyal ones, and I don’t think it’s fair).

Don Fnord, I told you my personal expectation (some attention). It’s not “only” focusing on raising the members situation. It’s caring about it.

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I’m just leaving a data point here as an example of those who can’t in any way understand this kind of approach and attitude.

You are of course in your right to approach this however you see fit, I don’t have anything against you personally, and I honestly thank you for supporting Fairphone as much as you do.
And as the community aspect seems important to you, too, welcome to the community forum :wink: .

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Hi again mytro

thanks for explaining your point of view a bit more!
Now at least I can understand your motivation about this topic a bit better - even if we don´t share the same point of view.

I guess that´s ‘normal’ in almost all countries (at least the ones that got capitalism as base of their society :wink: )
Simply spoken:
New customers bring in fresh money so they are the loved and cared ones.
Old/loyal ones usually only get that amount of ‘love’ back from companies if they bring in fresh money, too (buying, licensing more, consuming, etc).
We´re still living as a global society in ages of money.
Everything else is (or at least seems to be) subordinated.

Let´s quote it with that old Metallica song: sad but true …

PS: I don´t care about the care from organizations or businesses anymore - only about the care from other real people :wink:

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I’m involved in lots of “fair” organizations (some are companies, some are association, some are else). Some have the same point of vue, but don’t understand when they collapse. A project like this one is based on a community that make it grow. I don’t even think about fidelity program.

A good company understand how to increase, by making his first clients his first salesperson (in french we say prescriber).
In my experience, those who consider their first client just with vocation, without caring about their first client, collapse. Because the first ones are the easiest to convince to continue buying our products, they already have been interested (it’s called in french the first circle), it’s the cheapest way (the “freshest” money), even if it’s not enough. That’s how Apple reflects, and it seems to work. That’s why I’m having some question about the future of FP.

That’s not so “true” as you say. Just because we’re living as a global society in ages of money.

I also care about other real people (but even if I like FP, it’s not the only solution, and it’s a global market). And if I care, I care about the commercial content of this company, to make it bigger. For exemple, the support service should answer quickly for “maintenance”. Caring counts, but FP has to be such meticulous as “unfair” companies, because they’re in the same market.

That’s why I alert (I’m disappointed, but it not only concerns me).

PS : If you want we can compare our commitments about the care from other real people. It would only be ego, I think I’ve nothing to prove anymore about this, but even if it’s not helpful, it’s feasible.
PS2 : forgive me for my bad english, we’re not very fluent in France, and I’m not better than the others.

I didn´t want to compare anything; just described my point of view and hoped that also others jump in and describe their view at this topics, too, since you´ve raised that question about shareholder discount. I think it´s worth a discussion.
Sorry if you understood it a bit in a way that there were words of “I´m better than the rest or better than you” swinging inbetween the lines. That never was my intention.
By the way: I think your english is very good. I´m also no native english speaker and I can understand your words pretty good (much better than some other native speakers I´ve met or read in my life :wink: )

Best
DonFnord

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@DonFnord so far I did not jump in, as I’m currently a bit annoyed of all those negative posts about someones expectations and the their dissapointment when not met by Fairphone. Most times when then in a topic people dont get agreement, but disagreement the disappointment increases and one thinks its against them personally. So such topics are in my eyes to collect agreement that Fairphone is bad and not to discuss views.

I agree with what you said and I also try to have no expectations, especially not with companies. I think as long as one does not phrase the expectations, the other party has no clue about it so most times they will not be met and than there are negative feelings.

@mytro yes, so far most companies, even the “better” once treat new customer better and I also dont like this. I think the only way to change minds is to go to in this case Fairphone and tell them, maybe they have just not thought about it, maybe there are other reasons. However I think you cannot expect they know what you think and want.

I understand your point of view, it’s your form of disappointment. You see it in such a forum, but these people are customers, and even with their faults, the’re essential for the life of these companies.

It’s not “good” vs “bad”. FP is in the good camp. Otherwise I wouldn’t buy their products, or being shareholder (for solidarity, for helping to grow, we have no expectations of earning money).
That’s what I said before, it’s important to take this alerts in consideration. Most of users didn’t choose FP. Some of users, who are already out of the ordinary. Already convinced are not the best helpers to open up to a largest scale. It’s because they’re different that they make beginning possible, but it’s because they’re different that they’re most empathetic (like me) about workers and not about customers obstacles.

People use forums on an easiest way for complaints. For example, I don’t talk in forum about all the compliments about FP, because it’s a forum for already convinced, and I rather convince other than confirm whit already convinced. Forum is usually for “geeks”, “problems” and “complaints”.

I wanted to talk about that to FP, but the access to them is difficult (no answer by mail at the beginning, that’s why I was feeling disappointed). Even phone number was inaccessible. That was my alert.

I don’t read other topics, so I may understand your point of view, if several topics are like this (by the way, it may shows some lacks, and for a fair company, reputation is even more important than for the others), you could be busy about it.

I don’t agree with your point of view, trying to have no expectation, especially not with companies. That’s because of these expectations that we chose FP particularly.

By the way, thanks for your answers, I don’t know about my shares yet, but I may buy a Fairphone 4 in this coming month.
And thanks for your compliments about my english.

From France, best regards.

I’m not a geek, I’m here to help others and that is my contribution to the Fairphone Movement. Yours is money and mine is time.

Reg. using forums for complains: this is a user forum, so your complaints are hardly heard by those you want to address and at the end you address those which are already in the same boat.

I did not choose Fairphone because of any expecations I have or had. I choose them, because they help me to change my view about life, people, the earth, nature etc and I help them to change things. So you can say “I choose” and you cannot say “we choose”.

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