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Anyone have a NagerIT fair mouse?

fairelectronics
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#21

So, it finally arrived today, my NagerIT fair mouse. I promised a little review so here it is.
Let’s cut right to the chase and start off with what’s basically my conclusion: I’m slightly disappointed by it.

To start off, the website promised me (more or less) that this would be the mouse I’d get, but the mouse I got has green buttons instead of black and the white part of the body looks, well, cheap compared to what they showed on the picture. The right mouse button also has no perforated Nager IT logo but just simply a black picture placed in it’s position.

I’m sad to say that the mouse doesn’t feel like a high quality product. The design makes it look like a mouse from 1990 (although I like the look of the extended right-mouse button), while I didn’t really get that vibe from the picture. The USB cable is very thin. This shouldn’t matter too much but it gives it a bit of a lower quality feel and might actually be more prone to breaking. The green color of the mouse buttons isn’t smooth, it’s got swirls of white through it, which makes it look like it was liquid white plastic with a green coloring agent added to it that didn’t mix up properly with the plastic so there’s still tiny swirls of unpainted plastic in there. Even clicking the mouse buttons doesn’t have a quality feel to it. The click is too sharp. It’s hard for me to put it to words (especially in English) but it just doesn’t have that premium feel to it.
Also, the upper half of the body and the lower half of the body can be wiggled against each other just a millimeter or two. During normal use this isn’t really a problem but again, it just makes the mouse feel really low quality. The size of the mouse is also a bit on the small side. That’s probably a personal preference but for me, it makes the mouse not the most ideal one to work with.

Now you may say "oh, but what does all that matter, it’s about being fair, right?"
Sure, but I think that especially FairPhone has proven that you can make triple-A quality products while remaining conscious about and actively involved with the fairness of the product. With the FairPhone (FP1), I feel I have a product in my hand that doesn’t do under for the average Samsung, HTC or even Apple phone. The build quality is rigid, the software feels good and it feels like a high quality, premium device. Nager IT’s fair mouse, however, feels like a huge compromise.

It’s kind of like adopting a diet of nothing but potatoes and tree leaves or something because you want to minimze your impact on the eco system. That’s noble and all, but it just doesn’t compare to a juicy steak with a good glass of wine. FairPhone showed us we can have our steak and be fair (or at least aspire to fairness). Nager IT’s mouse is like eating raw potatoes instead.

At a price of almost €37 euros (including shipping) I simply can’t recommend this to anyone. €37 euros buys you a very high quality, premium built (wireless) Logitech or Microsoft mouse. They may not be as fair, but I truly believe that if you want fairness to remain sustainable, you’ll need to up your game and provide products that can compete with the (non-fair) competition. IMO, Nager IT’s fair mouse can’t, certainly not at this price point. It feels like a €10 mouse with a €25 added premium. I don’t mind paying a little extra for fairness if I’m happy with the product, but this is too much of a price hike for it to be a sensible purchase.


#22

We had a little unboxing party last week here at the office when a collective order of 6 fair mice arrived. I loved that there was a little map of the supply chain in every box, great idea! For a very brief moment the overall joyous atmosphere was placed on hold when we’ve discovered that the order for two mice of variant 2 looked differently from the photo on the website (and surprisingly the German and English page for orders even displays different mice for variant 3), but we’ve quickly recovered from that “shock”.

Today I’ve brought the above post to the attention of the people who had just received a fair mouse and asked if somebody would post her or his reaction, since I have already contributed to this thread. And one colleague spoke from my heart with a comment I put on here without asking (je suis désolé!) and only slightly edited for a broader audience: “The same happens with the FP2. The feedback is driven by aesthetic and subjective arguments (e.g. “low quality”) with a strong focus on product design and “look & feel/haptics”. Replace in the text “NagerIT” by “Fairphone”, “mouse” by “FP2” and “Microsoft/Logitec” by “iPhone/Samsung” and this is for a good part the feedback of the quality of the FP2 we get a lot or can be found in press articles about the first fairer and modular smartphone in the world."

And personally I want to add my “favourite” article from Chip.de: http://www.chip.de/artikel/Fairphone-2_Black_Matte-Handy-Test_87058830.html

Plus (damn, I must restrict myself better): I fully understand the author of the previous post and I too want good products for good money! And I truely believe that customers deserve good quality and service if they pay a reasonably fair amount for a product (don’t use that quote on me if you happen to get me on the phone when calling customer support LOL). But… and this is a really good but. E.g. In fashion branded products tend to have a higher quality due to better fabrics and tailoring. And I am not saying that you cannot dress well and look great if you don’t wear brands. The comparable non-branded product misses most of the time the feature that makes the branded version so attractive. And the brands know that so you don’t pay double (because that would just cover the marketing costs) but thrice! On top and then I really stop… my favourite community manager would know jump to my rescue and recommend that book (wish I could remember) about hidden costs. So the regular price we pay for mice and we are used to might be far too low and the fair mouse from Nager-IT a bargain in the end. Some more on this here: http://www.sustainablecommunication.org/eco360/what-is-eco360s-causes/hidden-costs


#23

I don’t disagree with most of your post, except for one point: I seriously don’t feel the FP1 I have is of a lesser quality than the HTC phone I had before.

I still use the fair mouse at work though. My colleagues jest me with comments like me being a tree hugger and comments like that. It’s always in good fun of course. But it’s definitely a subject that’s brewing around me. When I got my Fairphone, it did get people to talk about the issues in the electronics industry. When I introduced a plastic recycling bin at work, it got people talking about waste and the issues surrounding that. When I got my fair mouse, people did go “oh, there’s the tree hugger again”, but they were interested in the story behind it. In the end, that’s the most important thing of course.
And yeah, that green glowing mouse does draw attention :slight_smile:


#24

I am also part of the individuals who ordered a fair mouse.
Let’s make sure that everybody understands that us working at Fairphone who reply here are doing so in our names, not in the company name.

TL;DR: I like it

We are not saying that we believe we are making a bad phone. But it is true that we are hearing complains about people feeling that the device is a lower-range than what they expected because <put your reason here>. (And also people really happy about it :sunglasses:.)

I don’t want to begin a debate here, and I don’t feel like you guys need a reminder about what we are doing anyway :wink:. My point is that the NagerIT fair mouse is also a (good) step towards fairer electronic products. Yes, it is more expensive. Remember the late 90’s and the electronic goods? The market law is powerful and the manufacturing quantity definitely means something when it comes to costs. Plus, as Reent said, we don’t know many things about the true costs of the usual mice: sourcing, raw materials, labour, etc. So it is likely that

I’d like to see a cost breakdown for the NagerIT fair mouse, too. Compared to the regular mice costs, that could be really interesting and help people understand why the difference is so big.

On the mouse itself, it does feel like an old fashioned mouse. I am use to having this kind of mouse to work so nothing really changes here (except the wooden wheel :heart_eyes:). It is not a gaming mouse (at least I would not use it for that) but does the job correctly.
To me, the thin USB cable is more a plus as it does not get in the way too much.
I don’t have any quality issue such as cracks, gaps, or coloured LED not tainted well.

EDIT: They do not want to publish a cost breakdown because it would be too complex (plus they think it would only mislead the readers).


#25

to make this clear…

I quote:
"I’d like to see a cost breakdown for the NagerIT fair mouse, too. Compared to the regular mice costs, that could be really interesting and help people understand

  • -> why the difference is so big."

! Nager IT-mice aren’t more expensive because of fairer conditions
(which fill in almost 70% by now)
within their supply-chain.
They are more expensive because of the low amount of whatever is to be bought for production process-

so for example non-fairly-produced parts (making the 30 non-fair percent of SC) to be ordered in China lead to the higher price …


#26

NagerIT is not a professional company, is a project that tries to build a fair OEM mouse run by people in their spare time. They are not a company with risk managing & marketing PR and research. It’s all volunteer work, as far as I know. They mainly use Facebook for their communication so I don’t really know what they are doing recently.

My ideas for NagerIT: Most companies allow their employees to buy “ergonomic” mice for their workplace. Maybe they would get more success if they would offer a few more cases, it’s the same hardware anyhow. User could just move it over. One vertical case, one for bigger hands and one for smaller hands. Even a trackball with a wooden ball could work :wink:

Most users want ergonomic … if they get that, they will use their mice for a long time. Else they get replaced by something that “fits”.


#27

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#28

#29

This product was discussed at a 35c3 Lightning Talk Day 2 presentation about Faire Elektronik by Verena Kaiser of Nager IT.

Starts at 1h40m. Auf Deutsch.

I found it interesting because, as Verena explains, a mouse is a relatively simple device and they succeeded making it fair. The presentation includes a list of parts with where they’re sourced from.

(Oh, and FP is mentioned at around 1h43m :slight_smile: together with Nager IT being one of the very few companies who are into fair electronics.)


#30

I have mine since 5 months now and no complains so far. It looks so much better than the cheap Logitech mouse I had before.
It is a little smaller than what I expected but that hasn’t turned out to be a problem for me.

Edit: because JeroenH mentioned gaming, I’ve used the mouse to play things like Wolfenstein II.


#31

I don’t care much about looks with regards to hardware (all the LED kinky stuff isn’t for me, for example, though on a keyboard it can be useful to have it as option during dark time). If there’s a color preference mine isn’t common anyway (orange is my fav). So I usually end up with black or grey (I dislike the white trend put forth by Apple).

If I play a game I need good performance, so I prefer a mouse tailored for that. If its an MMO it’d be something with 12 keybinds such as a Razer Naga. I don’t currently play any MMO, and the gaming I do is 2 hours a week without it being real-time. A Nager IT would be suffice because of that. But my current mouses (a Razer Deathadder and Razer Naga, both mechanical) still work fine.

If I don’t play a game I prefer Apple Magic Trackpad 2 over any mouse (without the force touch because those are too big and aren’t sold separately either). Its the one where the click comes out of the speakers (and I put it on silent mode). Hands down the best trackpads and the portable ones work over BT and USB (lighting to USB-A). Mine’s in spacegray, and I got it working on Linux since kernel 4.20 (you need to compile a module with DKMS for previous kernels). That being said, I don’t have much experience with Apple Magic Mouse.

An acceptable alternative for a trackpad for low/casual pointer usage is a knob such as the trackpoint. Especially if you are accustomed to keybinds and don’t have much pointer usage its a decent, cheap option.

If you have high standards I don’t think this mouse is gonna be for you akin to how a FP2 might not be for you if you prefer a high end smartphone. I’d say the Nager IT mouse usage should be stimulated in company and NGO usage. At such that is where the volume lies. For such a mouse is usually OK, and if this mouse is as good as a random cheap Logitech mouse (which you argue it is) then its going to be good enough for a great many people. But for a small company like it might be difficult to produce in volume, I don’t know.

One final note, if someone is not gaming latency generally does not matter (in some games it does not either as it only matters in real-time games). In such a situation a Bluetooth mouse could be suffice. Why Bluetooth? Less cables, easier to switch to another device. Cables are annoying and ugly. Though Bluetooth also has various downsides. What I like about the Apple Magic Trackpad 2 is that the Bluetooth is optional. If you want to use it over USB you can opt for the lightning cable (I guess I prefer USB-C over that but OK).


#32

AFAIK their biggest deal in 2018 was with the police of Lower Saxony who equip 19,000 PCs with the fair mouse.


#33

But they work.
I would be more careful with phrasing that for moody diva tech like Bluetooth or WiFi :slight_smile: .


#34

Yeah, and cables break more easily. Though I have to say that the cable of my NagerIT has survived its buttons… The right one sometimes fails me.

Also the laser is not as precise as a higher end mouse from Microsoft that I have (where the plastic casing is so worn out that the left side doesn’t reach down to the left button properly anymore). At least NagerIT would send out spare parts whereas getting a spare part for the MS mouse is hopeless… (I now use nail polish to fix the worn out plastic part and make it slightly longer.)


#35

Cables can break (some easier than others), too, and BT can be reliable (again, some better than others). In the case of Bluetooth pointer devices the receiver can be pretty close to the pointer device. With an Apple Magic Trackpad 2 you have the choice between BT and USB. I like having that choice. And the case of this device the battery lasts very long (some 8 years ago I had a Razer Naga with a battery and the battery life was terrible). Batteries are worse for the environment though.


#36

I’m using my Nager IT mouse for 5 1/2 years now and it still works well.