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Leaving a movement

You care but there is nothing to be added to this statement: [quote=“fp1_wo_sw_updates, post:19, topic:20270”]
The FP1 is a lost cause. It was a prototype for learning on how to get “fair” minerals from a supply chain into a standard phone.
[/quote]
Well then we do definitely have a different understanding of the term “being valued”. Why are your limits exceeded by getting the device repaired by the company that checked my device? And I do not accept the statement made by the support: “it was not made to be repaired in that way”.

It feels good that many people here do understand my reason to post here and why I am disappointed. I really do, but it is upsetting that all of you find different causes for the problem just not the company Fairphone it self. I was not able to pick a company to check my phone, it was Fairphones choice. The company tells the support the reason for the problem. The support could have come to the conclusion that this is something which is caused by poor quality and not by improper use. Maybe the company that checked the phone is even willing the repair the device but Fairphone is just more interested in making more money by selling spare parts.

You are right, my formulation was wrong there.

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Dear FrankM,

Thank you for your extensive list of issues here and taking the time to lay-out what your problems with Fairphone are. I am really sorry to hear you feel so strong and negative about what once was a movement you clearly supported.

From what I understand we failed to meet your expectations, both in product quality and the way we handle your disappointment. For this there are many reasons, but I won’t repeat them as almost all of them are listed in the various replies given in this topic. Also I feel that excuses and explanations is not what you want to hear.

Clearly we never set out to build a company to disappoint people and every time we do, we feel bad and hope there are ways to make things right again. We’ve been repairing, returning, swapping and taking Fairphones 1’s back ever since we started shipping them. And we learned a lot from this, as you can read here:

But there are times where we can not make good what is wrong.

We made the Fairphone 2 with all the lessons learned from the Fairphone 1 in mind. And at one point we have to let go of the Fairphone 1. In your case it seems that repairing was no option for our repair partner. If we are going to keep going as a company, we have to rely on our partners to make judgements for us. For example: if our transport partner returns a package as undeliverable, we are also not able to see locally if there really was no letterbox.

That does not mean we do not care about of supporters; it means that we are a real company and we are limited by resources and time in the amount of effort we can give to supporting a product and the people who bought it.

As said before, I am really sorry you feel this way and I think I can speak for our entire team if I say that we wished things were different. Sadly we can’t do anything for you in this case.

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I’m owning my FP2 now for 2 Months, 2 Weeks and 4 Days (that’s what ist tells me), so I don’t have much of experience with FP in general (despite some battery issues)
But keep in mind: For some good reason FP is delivering their phones without charger. That’s fine since nearly everyone owns a USB charger. But then FP cannot blame a buyer to use a wrong charger/cable!

Please rethink!

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Since it was the coating or mantling of the usb port then mechanical stress broke the usb compartment itself. Poor-quality of a single 15 cent usb port that never could be replaced by warranty after 18 months ? Yes, of course. Did FP ever promised to be more accomodating than other producers ? Of course not. The only lesson we can learn here is that all depends from the support team from the very first contact . Or as the “Kaleu” said in his darkest moment in his submarine, Das Boot: “Good men, thats all, only good men (saved us from drowning)”. A good supporter would have had saved Frank from the repair company. Even with a broken FP1 but a fair treatment maybe Frank would have again chosen next generations FP2. Now he is lost for FP.

Unfortunately Douwe exactly told us - more or less - that the lesson learned at FP was to let go for more support team members and/or more qualified support. However I am sure that FP2 especially its modularity was a clear decision not to enhance support for end customers, especially when it is only about FP1 from the past. But … suport is not only reduced for FP1. Think about it when you read again “Ooops, FP support for FP2 doesnot look in good shape these days”.

So you rely on a partner that has 12 years of experience with general smartphones and 2 years of experience with Fairphone that is not able to solder a USB-connector. There are at least 3 companies in the Forum that are able to repair the device and there is even a youtube video where people get taught how to do this within 2 hours. If you partner is not able to this with the great experience they have, well then I would suggest to find a new partner.
Speaking with your words, if a company is not able to deliver a package even though there is a letterbox (which is used by other companies), then this a problem of the company not of the recipient.
But I guess it is more plausible that you just don’t want them to repair the device because you make more money out of selling the spare parts.

Seeing this whole process with some distance it really feels like a break up. Isn’t that [quote=“douwe, post:30, topic:20270”] … we have to let go …
[/quote] something that people say if they break up with each other. At first I was really angry about the supports treatment of my case. Talking with that “All your fault attitude”, blaming me and only me for the damage (improper handling, external cause). Second I felt really disappointed that fairness and sustainability is not what Fairphone stands for. Taking the way of dumping a working piece of electronic just because the already known weak point broke down, instead of repairing it is neither fair nor sustainable. And lastly there is regret. Regret for having supported a company for which 2 years of costumers support is already to much.

If you want to break up, it is ok. But there is no “Let’s stay friends” and I am also not interested in getting together again sometime in the future. As I’ve said, my Fairphone experience ends here.

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This is the list in question: :slight_smile:

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Thank you for adding this information.

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I totally agree on that it is easy to understand the obstacles on the way, but not the ignorance. When the support tells you that this is not going to happen with FP2, or we are to busy with the launch of FP2 to help you, I, as someone among the first 10000 buyers, loose my faith in the company. The company is the staff, and the customers, and our belief in the project. And if that is not worth anything the project will die.
That’s when I decided to not buy a FP2. Now, I’ll try to stick with my FP1 for as long as it works, which is does, most of the days. 2 years and 8 months is not so bad. But I have been on my way to buy other phones many times.

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While I agree with @FrankM in many ways, we also have to be aware of the timeline … they needed a phone with a “open minded” Chinese ODM and they took what they could get. It was not about design, it was mainly about materials.

The more important flaw:

Fairphone never involved the users in the design or decision making process. The FP1 was a finished product, the FP2 was a finished product.

If somebody would have shown me the designs of the FP1 or the FP2, I would have been able to point out a few things. But I never had the chance. I just want to be able to comment on a design, they don’t have to implement my ideas, but I want to be able to give a comment before it gets produced.

I can understand that they have their own ideas and that they all must fit under a certain goal, but a open review never hurts.

Also all the ODM contracts are unknown. I’m not sure who is responsible for possible design faults and how much buffer there is to fix those. Also it would be interesting to know how much power Google and the SoC manufacturers have over the ODMs. Some designs only make sense because Google seems to have some power over the ODMs (the eMMMc is always on the mainboard). Samsung plays way too nice with Google, they would have the power to change things, but they don’t do it, so I assume lots of patents are involved.

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I received two emails from the support last week they contained the following two statements:

We will now inform our service centre that they can proceed with the repair of your Fairphone.

Your phone is as good as new and ready for you! We are sending your package out today.

@Douwe It this supposed to be funny?

Dear Frank, I am not part of the support team and I do not know what has happened there. But I can check for you. Please assume good faith.

No need. I got the device back not repaired as I requested. But my rating of the support just went from bad to horrible. Is the support really that lazy and only has 1 text module independent of the outcome of the support process?

I guess these are templates. No a bad thing most of the time, but it looks like they had none defined for your case. ;(

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I agree, templates are essential for the customer support. But throwing around templates that don’t have anything to do with the case is a sign of a terrible support and the wrong attitude to customer support.

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I agree to everything the original author said. My Fairphone1 (first batch) broke down two weeks ago. I haven’t even heard from the support until today, so I gave my phone to an independent, very experienced repair shop in my town. They first suspected the soldering of the usb connector to be broken and said they could repair it for 39€ - reasonable price! When they opened up the phone though, they discovered that there is a damage on the main board, so it’s irreparable. They eventually did not charge me anything since they could not fix it - that is service!! Shame on Fairphone though on building a supposedly sustainable and reparable phone that acquires a total damage after 2,5 years - just a few months after warranty ran out! I thought that’s more apple-style, but certainly not fair!!
Bought a new phone now, NOT Fairphone, because I am very disapointed with this company.

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That’s likely because they have a huge backlog:
https://www.fairphone.com/2016/08/04/were-sorry-to-keep-you-waiting-an-update-from-customer-support/

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yes, but it’s been 3 weeks (!) now and still no response… (except for the automated email at the beginning that they received my request and it will take a while dadada)

Is it me or am I the only one who doesn’t get this?

Why are you making an account on a Community forum to tell you are leaving the movement when you have never joined it in the first place?! I don’t see @user123 or @FrankM has ever helped anyone here on the forum like so many others did.

Stop complaining to other community members about what clearly is a company issue. You are polluting the forum with complaints no one here can help you with.

I suggest you go get a pen and a piece of paper and write Fairphone a letter.

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To be fair, every person who has ever bought a Fairphone has already joined the movement. Some are just not as involved as others.

On the contrary, input from the community can be quite helpful. I learned a lot just by reading this thread, and I believe OP can say the same.

I know I’m new and stuff, but here’s my take on this issue. Feel free to correct me.

I think the relationship between Fairphone the company and Fairphoners is more than just vendor and customers. What sets Fairphone apart from other smartphone companies is that it doesn’t exist just to make money. Likewise, users who choose Fairphone are not just after features and specs. They believed, at least at some point, that Fairphone was doing the right thing.

So it makes sense to me that “leaving a movement” should be like breaking up with someone. Try to sleep on it first. Ask yourself why you got into it in the first place, and if the alternatives really are better. (Every Android phone maker’s forums I’ve looked at so far are flooded with complaints against customer service.)

Peace~

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It is even more unsatisfying when you get your first reply after 4 weeks and it looks like this: “It might be silly but have you tried another cable to charge your device”.

Putting the convenience anyway that a smart phone has to offer (playing games, surfing the internet, …) it boils down to be a communication device. And in some situations it can help saving your life. If your device is not working and the support takes that long to react you are forced to buy a new phone after only 2,5 years. This contradicts Fairphones claim to be sustainable.

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