Fairphone Open OS roadmap discussion

[nohwann]

(Sometimes) worth the wait

@keesj

we are currently working on preparing a binary release. Interested FP2 owners can install this on their device without going through the trouble of compiling the operating system themselves.

@keesj

With the Fairphone Open Source OS (Fairphone OSOS), we want to create an OS for the Fairphone that helps users to gain full ownership of the device.

@keesj

we want you to have the possibility to take full control over your system. This is why it will be possible to enable root access in the developer settings.

We are so close to the target "If you can´t open it, you don´t own it!"

[fp1_wo_sw_updates]

@keesj

However, we want to work together with you to make the Fairphone OSOS a real alternative to Fairphone GMS. (…) So let’s discuss!

Sounds great. Can you give some more info about security fixes, distribution (update images for FP OSOS?) and how closely you will try to follow a even more open code base (“mainline”)? Thanks.

[anon72544029]

First I want to say that it is great that you want to offer this to us, and that you want to evaluate it with us is even greater!

@keesj

This means that we want to evaluate the possibility to include other app stores, e.g. F-Droid and in the future also include an alternative set of preinstalled (fair/open source) apps. So let’s discuss!

I would keep it simple, too. To add the F-Droid App Store as a System App would be good. We could also add K9 as E-Mail Client or Apollo as Music Player etc. and make sure that the basic needs of the Most Customers would be fullfilled.

But on the other side, what is with the People who want a clean System and install just what they need by themselves?

In my Opinion you should include Apps for the most common needs. An App Store, E-Mail Client and Music Player are pretty Basic for example.

But what im way more curious about are Updates. Google offers monthly security Patches for the Nexus Devices. Afaik the Patches are also included in the AOSP Source. Security is a really important Point, so monthly Security Patches or a newly compilated ROM to upgrade to from inside the OSOS would be a Must Have in my Opinion.

[Lidwien]

I would like to combine this with changing to the Fairphone Open Source OS.
That’s why I asked if perhaps it would be possible to integrate Fairphone Open Source OS and OpenGAPPS.
At the moment I already use F-Droid as much as possible.

[paulakreuzer]

Those steps were meant for a phone with FP OSOS.

[fp1_wo_sw_updates]

@Lidwien

That’s why I asked if perhaps it would be possible to integrate Fairphone Open Source OS and OpenGAPPS. At the moment I already use F-Droid as much as possible.

While I understand what you want, I can tell you that if you want OpenGAPPS you can more or less just stay on the stock ROM (just root it ). It’s more or less the same. OpenGAPPS only allows you to install a smaller subset of GMS.

Also I guess it does not really help that we use the terms GMS, GAPPS and OpenGAPPS here.

Most people want Google Maps, Google Search and Google Play (The store only works with Google Play Services running. Source: Wikipedia). This is what GMS and OpenGAPPS supply mostly by also adding background “services” to the phone. I’m not sure if this is true for all apps, though. But I think the user should make this decision “knowingly”.

I think all these apps/services can be called “GMS/OpenGAPPS”, can someone point out the ones that add background services?

Chrome Browser
Cloud Print
Gmail
Google+
Google Calculator (replaces stock/AOSP Calculator)
Google Calendar (replaces stock/AOSP Calendar)
Google Desk Clock (replaces stock/AOSP Desk Clock)
Google Docs
Google Drive
Google Fitness
Google Keep
Google News & Weather
Google NFC Tags (replaces stock/AOSP NFC Tags)
Google Now Launcher
Google Play Books
Google Play Games
Google Play Movies & TV
Google Play Music
Google Play Newsstand
Google Play services
Google Search
Google Sheets
Google Slides
Google Text-to-Speech
Hangouts
Hotword
Maps
Photos
Sound Search for Google Play
TalkBack
YouTube
(Source: Full Package · opengapps/opengapps Wiki · GitHub)

[Lidwien]

I must say I am getting confused.
On my computer I use Linux, Fedora, that’s opensource.
I would like if possible use opensource on my phone, but I still needs some apps like ‘NS reisplanner’ provided by the Google Play store.
I understood that Fairphone is working on a opensource system for the FP2.

[anon72544029]

If you want to install Apps from the Google Play Store, but don’t want to install the Play Store you can use APK Downloader.

You have to look for your App in the Web Play Store, copy the Link, Paste it in the APK Downloader and then you will Download the App directly to your Phone or PC and can install it.

While this is not much work, the downside is that you have to Update the App manually.

I think it would be nice for some People to have an easy way to install the GApps, but to include the GApps would make no sense like fp1_wo_sw_updates already said.

[Bergziege]

I just checked on the 1Mobile Market App-Store and “NS Reisplanner Xtra” is available there.
For 1Mobile Market you do not need to register. And you still avoid the GMS.

[paulakreuzer]

Yeah but we had a lengthy discussion on why not to use 1Mobile on:

Alternative Apps(tores): Living without Google (FP1)

Continuing the discussion from Welcome! Introduce yourself here!: Hi all! I had thought about opening a post about living without Google Apps, so @jerry1970 set the ball rolling. First of all: I use only one App-Store at the moment, namely F-Droid (For all F-Droid apps, which work for FP1(U)/2, go here). Besides I have Blankstore installed, but haven’t used it yet. Some apps I downloaded from Evozi APK Downloader or from their respective webpages. F-Droid features only 100% FOSS (Free and O…

Conclusion: It’s bad! Don’t use it!

[fp1_wo_sw_updates]

@Lidwien

I must say I am getting confused. (…)

I would like if possible use opensource on my phone, but I still needs some apps like ‘NS reisplanner’ provided by the Google Play store.

Sorry about that.

It’s like using the NVIDIA drivers on your opensource GNU/Linux Fedora. It’s possible and not a bad thing (and not a perfect example …). Don’t think too much about it. It’s just that as soon as you install the play store to download the ‘NS reisplanner’ app, your phone will contain background services that could send your personal data to google. I don’t know how they work, somebody else has to look into this.

Fairphone is not working on a opensource system for the FP2. They just offer the code and add fixes/patches if needed or get them from upstream. Some linux people and some Sony developers currently looking at QC chips, but a lot of the code for the chip (graphics, the “phone part”, wifi, gps, camera …) is closed as well. Only the linux/unix part is “open”. But that’s more than you get with Apple or a Blackberry. It’s just that google also wants your data.

I checked http://apps.evozi.com/apk-downloader/ to see if it’s possible to download the ‘NS reisplanner’ apk. But it’s not working

Update: There are ideas to create “open” gms services, but I assume google will kill them and the related accounts at some point in time and if too many users use it. But I have not looked into this. In the end it’s the old “cloud” question. Do you want to give your data and the data of your friends to google and facebook or the creator of the apps you use or not. That’s all, I guess. But there are more important things in life



[paulakreuzer]

@fp1_wo_sw_updates

There are ideas to create “open” gms services, but I assume google will kill them and the related accounts at some point in time and if too many users use it. But I have not looked into this.

I don’t see why Google should have the power to kill the microg project?!

[Bergziege]

I didn’t want to canvass 1Mobile Market, I just wanted to point out that Lidwien’s statement was wrong, that “NS reisplanner” was only available on Google.

[fp1_wo_sw_updates]

@paulakreuzer

I don’t see why Google should have the power to kill the microg project?!

I don’t want to spread FUD, but they can just change the APIs or block accounts that access “their” services in a “strange” way. I’m just assuming. Don’t forget how google makes money: Currently it’s just dodging taxes and selling advertisements. The rest is still small and growing. Nobody knows what they will do in the future.

I wouldn’t bet on not being evil … AMP could change the way advertisements and newspapers work (or not) and I saw walking robots today (quite nice, btw).

[paulakreuzer]

Maybe I’m just too tired but I couldn’t make sense of a word of what you just said. (The text jumping around due to your constant edits didn’t help either )

[fp1_wo_sw_updates]

@paulakreuzer

Maybe I’m just too tired but I couldn’t make sense of a word of what you just said. (The text jumping around due to your constant edits didn’t help either )

TLDR: One can’t tell but as soon as it will hurt their business model, they will. Currently that is not a problem.

[jftr]

@fp1_wo_sw_updates

I don’t know how they work, somebody else has to look into this.

The point is that no one knows because they are proprietary and closed source.

[fp1_wo_sw_updates]

@jftr

The point is that no one knows because they are proprietary and closed source.

True, but I guess the microG Project looked into it just to be able to recreate it. It looks like there is a F-Dorid archive so people can just test it. MicroG seems to be the real “OpenGAPPS” anyway

[paulakreuzer]

No, no, no. MicroG doesn’t recreate anything googly like openGapps. They create fully FLOSS apps & services that don’t need Google at all. They just name some of the packages the same as the Google packages so they can easily implement them into Android.

[keesj]

The goal for the security fixes is to align the different release as much as possible. This allows us to perform less build specific testing and align the feature set.